First, how would he know if a division emerged within the ranks of the former board? They certainly wouldn't discuss it with him. While this happened after the audit of the computers (factual), it implies that the audit had something to do with it. If it is non-binding mediation, then if a settlement cannot be reached, the case will continue in court, which solves nothing for the town.

Sigh, he mixes facts with fiction and uses the facts to imply they are related. I don't see this as news, I see this as another 7th grade level editorial. His anger has certainly taken over as of late. He no longer cares for the truth.

As with all his false implications, there will be no retraction when he is proven wrong (again). I'm pretty sure former Chief Joyce is not holding his breath waiting for an apology from this immature brat.

People, like all other public forums court documents are a public record and thanks to this nifty internet quite readily available. You want to read some serious malformations of truth? Just read the documents submitted by attorney's (who have taken a swore oath by the way) on behalf of our legal lusting do you know who I am elected "officials". This is what your money is being spent on!
http://dockets.justia.com/docket/court- … id-111766/

The Ragman should resign immediately.  For the past few years, a cornerstone of his reporting is that all sort of untold evil will be revealed when the trustee lawsuit goes to trial, and that the evil power elite is so scared about what will be revealed when the case goes to trial that they will do anything to stop it - that the blogs are a smoke screen to distract people from all of the evil that will come out - that the recall effort is just an attempt to remove the selectmen so the case can be dropped and the all of the evil things the evil library did will remain hidden.

Well, Ragman, here's a question, if there really is so much evil lurking behind the library - why would the selectmen ever settle the case then - why wouldnt they push for a trial so all of that unspeakable evil can be put out into the public?  If the BOS is right, then why would they ever entertain the idea of a settlement?

Last edited by Hamatron5000 (2009-06-24 12:24:59)

When the Paddlethon started, Marilyn Donahue made a plea to the selectmen to go into mediation at one of their meetings. That was not the first time the selectmen were asked. I read in the real paper in the past that the trustees asked for mediation before this. And what did it cost the town to keep refusing mediation? Legal fees, legal fees, legal fees.

Thanks to Iliveinazoo for the court dockets. Who knew you could get such a thing? I see the real reason for the extension was "emergency medical" reasons of the K and P lawyer. So how was that related to Slager's comment: "But after the town asked for, and received, additional time for discovery on June 11 for its countersuit (which alleges conversion of public funds), the trustees decided to unanimously support mediation to end litigation as quickly as possible."

Only a desperate moron trying to get people to sign up for his site would connect those two. Well, sure, according to the date it was after the discovery. But what makes him think it was the extension that made the trustees "decide" to support mediation? Slanted yellow journalism at its best.

And yes, MsLilly, I did copy all that was online. I have a question---does Slager give the trustee's name who was interviewed? If so, please pass it along here. If not, guess what that tells me? Just another one of Slager's lies.

Actually, the former trustee says that all but 2 them voted for mediation, but that there were 2 holdouts...

And come on Molly, even you should be able to figure out that no one in this town would ever be willing to talk to anyone about this unless they were guaranteed they could remain anonymous...all except our observer guys, BillW and Mr. Slager, that is...so if you don't put your full legal name on your blogs, does that mean I am to assume you are a liar? Of course not...

Hopefully we will all encourage our BOS to spend just a few more $$ in legal fees to find out what the real truth is regarding the library and not to settle...either the trustees will be vindicated or not...but before that happens, I will keep an open mind and not call anyone a liar or anything else for that matter...I would just like to know the truth...

ihateliz wrote:

ms lily crap in your hat.

I don't care to know the reason why, but thank you for using the least amount of abuse on me to get your point across...and I am sincere when I say that...I am not baiting you to unleash more...one crappy head a day is enough for me... ;-)

Ms. Lilly:
How can you listen to the 6 minute audio and then put a single ounce of trust into these people? They have violated the very core of democratic process.
Ihateliz:
That wasn't necessary, we are all entitled to our points of views.

MRM...if you read the entire article, this former trustee quoted is in no way giving the BOS a free ride by any means...there is still a lot of obvious hate mentioned towards them...if I remember correctly, they even said the recall should still happen...I think this trustee cares more about the library than either party involved, but of course I could be wrong...

And I think we need to get the results from the audit before we can call any un-named sources re: the police department or library bogus...

It is very nice to know that you are also willing to wait out the truth...I hope more of us will try and do the same...

And to you ILIAZ, thanks for always being the gentleman...in regards to the 6 minute audio, that is exactly how I can still trust the BOS...because I only heard 6 minutes of it...and I feel guilty I heard that much...if executive sessions were not meant to be private until the entire issue is resolved, then we wouldn't have them...we all know how misunderstandings can happen when something is taken out of context...not so much with some of Mr. Cronan's remarks, but still...they are entitled to discuss things privately...maybe at the following meeting Mr. Cronan would have said his assumptions were all wrong, etc...

Ms Lilly,
Based on a few facts I have about the BOS and ITA, I wouldn't trust them as far as my mother could toss them! I quit reading Slager's nonsense once it went private. I have my own issues with Slager, but suffice it to say he is not particularly honest and forthright. Now, given what I know for a fact about both parties, I firmly believe they are the wrong people to be leading this town. Now back to the point:

I believe the trustees not only have a good case, it is very likely they will win, but like the town of wareham, legal fees....legal fees....

Unless it's earth shattering, the audit is going be the anchor tied around the BOS's neck. You cannot preach fiscal responsibilty and commission an audit during a full blown financial crisis. Like I said, it better be earth shattering or the BOS should be writing their resignation letters.



Molly,
There are penty of articles and people in town willing to talk about the BOS/library issue. This also includes Bruce/Pillsbury, and how the police department ended up on the naughty list.

Ms. Lilly, the trustees were dismissed because the bos said they were not properly appointed. How could anything on the library's computers be connected to that? It is a false correlation. The trust fund is also being questioned. Again, do you think there is some sort of secret details on the computers at the library? Wow, if you believe that, but then again, you seem to believe everything Slager says. But, when the truth be told, the people in town will realize that just as we had no reason to go to war in Iraq (no weapons of mass destruction) you will find that there was no reason for the bos to declare war on the trustees/library. The only reason it has turned into a "civil" war as you claim is because Slager has twisted the story so much that people not willing to get the truth see the library as evil.

Again, what is wrong with a settlement? You want the bos to spend more of your tax dollars taking this to court? If they are proven wrong, they should settle. To not do so would be totally irresponsible. By the way, it takes a year or two just to get a case scheduled in court, so if this goes to court it won't be over for years. Legal fees, legal fees, legal fees. Fiscal Responsibility? Not to my way of thinking.

Ms. Lilly:
A couple things I want to point out, the BOS alleges that they found a loophole in the appointing of the Library Trustees. This begs the question WHY were they LOOKING for a loophole?
The 6 minute audio is not taken out of context, it is a clear indication of what is happening behind closed doors. Plotting against Town employee's is NOT an acceptable reason to be in Executive Session. Not to mention the ES was illegal as there was no open meeting.
A little investment in time reading the court documents clearly shows that the Town is making an active effort to get its hands on the money donated and bequeathed to the library. They will never win that argument in court. A waste of tax payer dollars.
You really have to step back and look at the big picture here:
We are spending an inordinate amount of money on litigation, some of our largest legal expenses are directly related to certain actions this BOS has taken (i.e. library, terminations). To support this we have sacrificed our recreation department, cut our library in half, failed to fully fund our COA, failed to place lifeguards on any of our 54 miles of coast line, failed to hire more police officers or provide them with the equipment they need to do their job safely, refused to fund our schools to ensure EVERY child in Wareham gets a quality education, left key management positions unfilled (the TA has been vacant for a year now, not to mention the Planner position), and we have been forced to reduce our labor force resulting in a reduction in service to the tax payer.
Government is supposed to provide a balance, to act in the best interest of the whole not the few. I would be interested to hear why you believe that the sacrifices every Wareham tax payer has been forced to make benefit the community as a whole. Our tourism is down, that should come as no surprise. No one wants to travel to a place that is perceived to be unsafe (not enough police oficers and no lifeguards). We have neglected the village of Onset and Downtown. These locations should each be a thriving destination for citizen and tourists alike to enjoy.
Our attention and resources are all geared towards litigation to the DETRIMENT of everyone. I can tell you from personal experience, nothing good ever comes out of a courtroom. The only one benefiting from this legal war fare is K & P.
A decade from now the children of this community will not look back on this period of time and say "thank goodness we fought all those legal battles". Rather, they will say "why did our parents allow this insanity?"
Give it some thought Ms. Lilly.

MsLilly wrote:

Would you agree that the BOS had a right to act if it is proven that money intended for a public library is unaccounted for?

I have no direct knowledge of the issue, nor am I a "library lobbyist" but the problem is....

The BOS don't have the right to act.  They are the policy makers.  It's the Town Adminstrator's job.  The Board is NOT to get involved in the day to day operations of Town.  THAT is in the charter.

The other issue was just brought up by iliveinazoo, WHY were they looking?  Once again, not their job.  I'm willing to bet no one brought it to their attention.  They would have mentioned that by now.  They took it upon themselves to see if they were appointed properly on their own for a reason only they know, because they have never made that clear.

If it was just a simple misunderstanding of the charter, the BOS could have easily made note of it and had the current members keep their appointments based on their TWENTY YEARS (was it) of serving in that capacity.  Plain and simple.  It was personal.

As far as the legal stuff, this was the first legal mess and it was years ago.  Let's think of the many things that have followed that cost the town tens of thousands.  It wouldn't surprise me that the Board would want to mediate with all that is on their plate.

I'm sorry Ms. Lilly, I understand you want to believe in those you support, but there are too many questionable actions with this matter.

ILIAZ, I agree whole heartedly re: lawyers being the real benificiaries in all this mess...but that is true everywhere, not just here...and as far as tourism being down, I don't think we can really blame that entirely on our leaders, can we?  Florida can't even sell Disneyland these days...

I thought it was the trustees who brought the lawsuit against the town first, not the other way around...and if the trustees were in violation of our charter by not having the town treasurer as their treasurer, why didn't they just turn over the financials like they were supposed to instead of bringing a lawsuit against the town...perhaps it was the $75,000 they admitted to sending over to Spinney (a private entity) that got our leaders thinking that someone really needed to check up on what was happening with the rest of the money meant for our town approved public library...

I just don't understand what you think should have been done...why didn't they just turn over their books instead of filing a lawsuit?  It seems to me this whole mess could have been avoided had they just done that...at least the most costly part anyway...

Commonsense, I think I answered some of the things you pointed out with my answers to ILIAZ, but I will elaborate more if you want...

And my dear ihateliz, it is never a waste of time to talk to this nut...contrary to what some believe and no matter how much my husband would love it, I am not a Stepford wife, nor have I been brainwashed by the evil empire...I am capable of listening to opposing viewpoints with an open mind and can even come up with a rational conclusion on my own every now and then...why do you think I come here?  No, it's not because I love to be told to crap in my hat...well, maybe that's a little part of it...as I have said in the past, it's because it's not very educational to only ever listen to or read or speak with those that share a similar viewpoint...there is no possibility of ever being able to consider any alternative other than what you already believe to be true if you do and personally, I feel that to be very one sided and slightly small minded...okay, I'm going to go crap in my hat now and then go to bed...

Ms Lilly,
Another thread on here contrasts the writings of Urbon and Slager as it pertains to the trustee/BOS lawsuit. Now, based on our prior conversation, I have read both articles and come away with the following conclusions:
1. Urbon is stating facts and not basing his article on un-named sources or speculation.
2. Slager isn't reporting news, he is spinning tales based on urelated facts.

I am also a fan of listening to all sides of the discussion. Unfortunately, when it comes to the BOS (and Slager), what you hear or read is not making sense with the actions that follow. I've become jaded when it comes to either of the parties and what comes out of their mouths. It goes back to the basic concept of trust. If you cannot trust a person to back up their words with action or to tell the truth, you stop listening.

This is not to say it wasn't that way before this BOS took over, I wasn't around during those times. I can't imagine this being a better group of Selectmen, and if they are, I wonder why Wareham is still standing? 

I don't suscribe to the power elite or the downtrodden, so I don't have a dog in that fight. However, I do know a clusterf*ck when I see one, and the current BOS and ITA are a prime example!  After 25+ years in the business world I've gained a reputation for fixing problems, so it is easy to see that if something doesn't happen soon, the aftermath will haunt Wareham for years to come. Maybe it's as simple as the voters sending a message to the BOS that they aren't in charge, the voters are?  If that doesn't work, then it's time to put people in those positions who serve the people, not themselves. We are the CEO's of Wareham, not the Board of Selectmen.  If they say anything different, then they don't belong in those seats!

Flyspeck wrote:

Michael Jackson has suffered cardiac arrest and some reports say he has died in Los Angeles. His death comes as the Wareham selectmen conduct an audit of the town's computers.

Michael Jackson has suffered cardiac arrest and some reports say he has died in Los Angeles. His death comes as the Wareham selectmen conduct an audit of the town's computers. Michael Jackson's death followed on the heels of a former library trustee informing the observer that the library lobby was eager to settle all legal actions between the trustees and the town.  Clearly this will be remembered as a major historical event.

I heard Michael Jackson read a book once.  Now it's all starting to add up.

I bet he had a library card too.

Breaking News: Ragman buys Bubbles the Chimp at Jackson Estate Sale to assist with proofreading.  In a related story, production quality of the rag rises by 100 percent.