Surely it is not strong enough to "blind" a person. So save the melodrama Brenda.

Especially when he's 50ft or more away.  Front row to Brenda's seat is pretty far away.  Besides, he took her picture AFTER the meeting was suspended.

Most savvy politicians know that you just ignore interruptions, but if you make a big deal about it, the situation escalates.

In this case, Bruce and Brenda escalated.  It is was clearly something they prepared for and had a plan for.

Most good politicians do not take things personally and then attack their opponents. Whatever happened to working with your rivals rather than against them?? Isn't that what Lincoln and now Obama is doing? Aren't these BOS big Democrats??? Take a page from your idol Obama and start acting like politicians instead of kids in the school yard.

That's never going to happen.  Yet people will continue to come here and call us children.  Here's the deal, we all tried reason.  We all tried diplomacy.  We all tried to play nice.  They still threw there power around.  THIS board was the result.  Love it, hate it, we're here to stay because, THIS is where people with similar views listen and support one another.   

It is clear that when this bos does not like someone or some group, it is no holds barred. Brenda accused Dr. Bicki of being a member of the CBW but I know personally that he is not and has never attended a meeting. He was trying to show that Brenda is giving false information to people in town. Instead, she took it personally and made snide comments. How many times do they lie to us?

I just don't get the whole "evil" CBW.  A group of citizens want to form a political group and they're instantly evil?  Does the board truly believe they should be loved by all?  Does everyone support the president?  Is the president trying to destroy the Republicans?  How about the shitty Presidents that came before him. Is he blaming them for the countries problem?

They don't like the board of health, so when a person comes in and gives them false information, they are willing attack a kind, generous elderly man by kicking him off the board.  Don't ask for proof. I didn't for a minute believe their apologies. And notice, not every board member apologized to the Gleason family.

In a previous meeting Bruce, Jane, Cronin, and Brenda said all of them should resign.  Jimmy, have you're eyes been opened?  They threw you under the bus without blinking.  Too late buddy, your rep is tarnished.

Members of the bos and Slager have a strange sense of ethics. If you say it or print it, it is true. How fair is that to people who listen to the bos or read the rag? They are all a disgrace.

I have yet to meet these supporters that the BOS have helped that we're not insiders to begin with.  Where is the common citizen crying for the department heads to be fired?  Where are the common citizens calling for budget cuts?  Where are the common citizens crying out for Crime Watch to write parking tickets?

So I say go for it Bill. If these people can't stand the heat of your single flash, they should get out of politics.

I'm sure he'll get the same treatment without flash.  Causing a disturbance by lifting his arms.  Cause he might have a weapon in the camera, like that movie True Lies.  I'd watch out for old ladies and their huge handbags too.

Jeb wrote:

Molly wrote:

I recently watched President Obama in a news conference where literally hundreds of flashbulbs went off every

Big diff between a 'photo op' and conducting town business..

So Jeb, in your opinion, were Bill's rights violated? Just a simple yes or no will suffice.

Oh my Gaud!  MsLilly?  What are you doing here?  Stick around and join in the fun!  Nice to have you here.

MsLilly wrote:

Hiiii Mixie...I was hoping I wouldn't have to wait too long for the opportunity to let you know that I no longer consider you to be simply clever, but absolutely brilliant...!!! Thanks for being my very gracious welcoming committee...

Ohhh...my!  Thank you, but I just know I will be disappointing you very soon...so sorry, but we can still be friends....

I am sure you will not disappoint Mixie...you haven't yet...though I sure wouldn't mind getting that freakin tune to stop playing in my head today...

Jeb this is back and forth right this is one of the things you wished from this site less antics and more practical factual debate.  now you dont want to be the answer man what is that.

ms lilly welcome nice to see you. 
here is my position on the cbw .... not intimately involved and to be honest dont even look at their site.  however just the sheer fact that slager raised his back against them almost immediately because they didnt unquestionably agree with this board makes me suspicious. 
the name alone and the fact that people got together and expelled some time and energy is alone an  argument for what detractors of this site have been saying.   they say dont just bash people on the internet get out and try to make change.  this group does just that and somehow they are  an evil incarnate.

well hello my friend...it's been far too long since we've chatted...I guess if it takes me having to come on over to your playground to do so, then so be it....just don't throw me on (or under) the Comet just yet...  ;-)

Regarding your opinion on the cbw, I believe that we really need to look beyond a group's willingness and ability to assemble in order to create change before we can give them kudos for doing so...heck, wouldn't Hitler and his group of merry men still be on the top of the job well done list if that were not true?  I'd like to know a little bit more about their motivation through actions, and not just their mission statement before I'd be willing to climb on board...so far, I haven't witnessed anything that shows me they're concerned with anyone's betterment but a select few...if changes are going to be made, I'd prefer them to be for the benefit of the majority, not the minority...

Hey BOS, if you don't ike being in the lime ight, maybe you you should reconsider  where you are. Lets face it, if a flash bulb distracts you that much, I can see why Wareham is so screwed up. All of you on the BOS wear your heart on your sleeves. You allow everyone to seek out your weakness and allow them to prey on it. Being a political figure antwhere, exposes you to the harsh review of those that you represent. Its not as fun as you had hoped. You can't get your parking tickets fixed, you can't get free beach stickers, you can't get a get out of jail free card,hell, you don;t even have to pay your car loan (right Brucie) Listen, this town needs quality people with a general interest in doing good for the town they live in. Maybe you are in over your head but are afraid to admit it.
Try focusing on the issues at hand and forget the flash bulbs. If you can't handle the heat, then get out of the kitchen, because its only going to get hotter for sure.

Jeb wrote:

oneeardog wrote:

Jeb this is back and forth right this is one of the things you wished from this site less antics and more practical factual debate.  now you dont want to be the answer man what is that.

How about you answer "were Bill's rights violated? Just a simple yes or no will suffice"

and with a follow up of if yes, 'which or what right(s)'

hmm.. got a legal cite to back it up....

wait, one other....Can you tell me if Billw's 'flash' episode was calculated for a desired effect/outcome outside of picture quality by him? Did he succed?

hold on... 50' from Brenda, do you know if that is a factual statement
of distance , effective range of built-in flashs, what's with the microphone shadow on her?

Hey, it's just one, simple yes or no question, right?

TAG your it!!!

Now getting back to "less antics and more practical factual debate"

RIGHT !!!   A quick look in these forums will show that any poster with a differing view gets the same treatment as a person jumping into the Amazon with chicken parts strung from the neck.

Please excuse the fact that I don't take you half as serious you take your self.

If you forget to answer my simple question, want me to give a friendly reminder (like Flox did awhile back) in a few days?

Jeb, not to worry, I don't take either of us too seriously. If you like I could wait to answer for a few days if you like, orrrrr... Nahh, I'll give it a shot, but you have to promise to answer the question once I do, fair is fair.

I'll go with yes, no wait, no, umm, yes, my answer is yes.

No follow ups until you answer, but I will give you a hint. Let's say for the sake of argument we believe the writings in the rag that "Sauvageau said he would consider introducing a formal policy to prohibit flash photography while meetings are in session." And yes, I do have many legal citations to back it up.

Now isn't this more fun than swimming with chickens? The only reason I debate with you is because you don't take it so seriously.

MsLilly wrote:

I believe the voters of this town are not so much concerned with who holds the puppet strings, they simple don't want any strings at all...at least that's how I perceived it...

Hello Ms. Lilly, welcome to the boards.  By the above logic, neither candidate would have stood a chance.  Cruz had the democratic town committee behind him.  If you don't know, it is headed by Jane and John Donahue, and its members contain Bruce and Brenda.  They have a dedicated voter block. 

That's what helped Cruz in the end.  This is also the same voter block the Donahues used to help with the votes they needed at the Water District Meeting, although it wasn't successful.

Frankly I'm tired to people only being in two categories, mostly labeled by Slager.  If you don't agree with Slager or the BOS your CBW (formerly labeled as the power elite).  I can assure you I am not CBW, but I don't agree with the current Boards politics. 

Just by contributing to this site I have been labeled both power elite and CBW by Slager.  Can't I just disagree?

Last edited by commonsense (2009-04-19 07:29:58)

Good Afternoon Commonsense and thanks for the welcome…

I agree with you …it stinks  (oh wait, I can say sucks here, can’t I?) that there is an us and a them…I know that there will always be those that agree with what our elected officials/administration do, certain issues, etc, and those who don’t, sometimes and sometimes not...the really detrimental thing that has happened here is that hatred has divided us as citizens…the issue/action at hand seems to be taking a backseat to how the BOS/Admin stand on it…if admin approves, they don’t and if they don’t, they do…we are zeroing each other out and when that happens, the only losers in that fight are us, the citizens, and that really sucks (oh, that was fun).

Let’s use the firing of the Town Accountant as an example…never met him…it’s been said he’s a good man and since I  have no reason to doubt it, I won’t…but good people do make mistakes and when they do, they need to pay the consequences…it is still amazing to me that our Administration would be criticized by some for the termination of an employee who paid out $35,000 of OUR tax money based on a sticky note and a couple of phone conversations for verification…are kidding me?…that’s the extent of the decision making process you want when you are talking about a position in control of all our money?  Please let me know of anyone who has an issue with that termination and I’ll send you a resume…I’d love to be your accountant…and I’ll even bring my own supply of Post-its…

There shouldn’t be a taxpayer in this town that isn’t thankful that this Administration took the steps to insure more of our tax dollars are not so easily given away in the future…

ILIAZ...

I am not trying to dispute the fact of whether or not Hartman was entitled to the money...my issue is with the fact that the town wasn't even given the opportunity to make that determination before our accountant turned over the money like there was a gun to his head instead of a post it...I want someone in that position who is going to put forth a little more effort than that when it comes to my tax dollars...

But, as far as if he was actually owed the money?  According to some, the premise for giving him the money without barely an eye lash batting was due to our poor record keeping…we couldn’t have proven we didn’t owe him the money…well, couldn’t that have worked the other way also? Record keeping was so bad he couldn’t prove we owed him the money…it is too bad we weren’t even given that chance…

Thank you for finally pointing out what is truly the topping on this illustrious cake…most of us would kill for just those benefits, skipping the salary entirely…can someone actually be sick 50 or 100 days during an entire career?  Sorry, “In the head” doesn’t count…. 

And you should be commended for attending the hearing…personally, I admire such involvement…

And let's not forget the letter from former TA John McAuliff that stated he looked into it, and found no wrong-doing.

Now that McAuliff is replaced by his former assistant, all of a sudden, there's a problem.  Hmmm

Ask around about how much Bliss' replacement temp is costing.  The amount will astonish you.

MsLilly:
I can only offer what I saw submitted as evidence and testimony at the hearings for Bliss.
Bliss did question the payment, keep in mind that back then according to every account except Brenda's the warrants were signed AFTER the checks were issued (not a smart policy but the BOS claims it has since been changed), so when Bliss questioned the payment an opinion from Town Counsel was requested and received. In fact, three people were involved in this opinion getting (Renne Fernandes-Abbott, Pat King and Bob Bliss). The e-mailed opinion told Bliss to make the payment unless there was evidence to dispute the payment. Not a single sitting member of the BOS ever attempted to dispute the amount owed, nor did John Foster who was ultimately responsible for the day to day operations at the time, and Bliss was in a bind. If he didn't make the payment the Town would be open to liability. This was a no win situation for him.
Did he deserve to be fired from the job he held for 15 years, under multiple TA's without incident, for doing what the Town's legal counsel told him to do? The answer is no, in fact, if anyone is going to get fired it should be K & P because it was their advice.
K & P also represents the Town I work in and when they give an opinion we follow it to the letter.
Now, does this situation bring to light some issues that need adjusting? Yes, warrants should be signed before checks are issued, TA's should have a double check system on their time off (in the Town I work in the BOS secretary does this), and the final lesson is that we need to ensure that the end justifies the mean. That isn't just an issue of money, but what has happened here is that by the time all is said and done we will spend close to $100,000.00 in tax payer dollars to do what? Nothing. And, Bliss will be re-instated or we will be forced to buy him out. K & P isn't even willing to represent us on some of these cases anymore, doesn't that tell you something?
Not to mention that we are fast becoming the laughing stock of the entire state and no one wants to work here. Oh, we may get applications but they aren't from anyone we want. This situation will keep spiraling out of control until people are willing to just look at the facts, take the rag out of the equation, take the TDC out of the equation, even CBW and just look at the facts. The pattern is truly frightening!

well put, no spin, no fingerpointing the facts speak for themselves .   just for edification for bob and bruce.  that post is an objective summary of the facts in case you missed them or were unaware that something could contain both objectiveness and fact.

Ms. Lilly:
Prior to the punishment these issues were being corrected, according to RFA under oath the BOS did not know this unaccounting was going on, of course, that brings up the whole day to day operations issue which I wil stay away from.
I do not understand what you are asking me to concede to, Hartman's contract was very similar to many, just recently Plymouth's Town Manager walked away with a six figure check for unused sick/vacation time. Do I agree with that, no, but that is the market. As for how it was any of the things you call it, well any of us could have seen his contract, the fact that most of us choose not to ask for those things is more shame on us for not asking. I have already left a message for Sanguinet asking for the form to request his contract, he didn't respond.
We will have to agree to disagree on the money spent. This BOS was given a complete accounting of this situation over a year ago, did we need to spend massive amonts of money and ruin the career of a good man? No we did not.
Now, let's take on a new topic, someone throw out a new one.
ps-Bill & Oneear, thanks, I am just here to set the record straight.

Ok..new topic....what do people see as the most pressing problem facing the Prudential committee?  Is it to work towards a one person clerk/treasurer or is it something else?  Does anyone think that Enos will work towards that goal?  Or is that even the goal of the Pru Committee?  I personally think the Donahue's are getting too much power and think they have enough support to do whatever they want.  Any thoughts as to why Courtney received the least amount of votes?

Sorry Ms. Lilly, I misunderstood.
Actually, as I stated, the information I have comes from spending three days sitting and listening, and taking notes.
According to the testimony Bliss did question the post it note payment voucher, that led to e-mails and calls to counsel by three people, Renee, Pat King and Bliss. No one was comfortable with the process which is why they contacted counsel, However, much to everyone's chagrin they were told it had to be paid. Based on Renee's testimony it seemed that she was not happy about the situation but followed the advice of counsel and signed the voucher. The others did not, however, no one has to date been able to dispute the claim. So no, I do not believe that there was any misguided agenda with that, I got the impression that everyone invlved would have been just as happy for the lawyer to say, don't pay it.
Thanks for the compliment, I am actually new to this site, found myself a little disillusioned after the election.....
Mixie, first thought about Pru Comm is we should have an appointed Clerk/Treasurer, second thought is where was Courtney on election day? I only saw Enos.... I have heard rumors he is the Donahue lackey, but if you looked at where his signs were you would note that many were in the same location as Winslow's were, so I do not know....
Back to Ms. Lilly, I think that if you spent some time just focusing on the facts, which is what I did during the election, you will find that most info out there is incorrect or cannot be verified. Slager admits his paper is his opinion, but he presents it like fact. The Courier and S-T do a terrible job of covering our news. There are a million issues out there that the public is mis-informed about. I am just here to give the facts, maybe I should change my name to fact finder, lol.

Mixie...great new topic choice...since my knowledge of the Pru Com is very limited, I'm looking forward to listening more, talking less and hopefully learning something...

ILIAZ....FF is certainly less keystrokes!